Page - 179 - in The Complete Plato

SOCRATES: How then can the rhetoricians or the tyrants have great power in states, unless Polus can refute Socrates, and prove to him that they do as they will? POLUS: This fellow— SOCRATES: I say that they do not do as they will;—now refute me. POLUS: Why, have you not already said that they do as they think best? SOCRATES: And I say so still. POLUS: Then surely they do as they will? SOCRATES: I deny it. POLUS: But they do what they think best? SOCRATES: Aye. POLUS: That, Socrates, is monstrous and absurd. SOCRATES: Good words, good Polus, as I may say in your own peculiar style; but if you have any questions to ask of me, either prove that I am in error or give the answer yourself. POLUS: Very well, I am willing to answer that I may know what you mean. SOCRATES: Do men appear to you to will that which they do, or to will that further end for the sake of which they do a thing? when they take medicine, for example, at the bidding of a physician, do they will the drinking of the medicine which is painful, or the health for the sake of which they drink? POLUS: Clearly, the health. SOCRATES: And when men go on a voyage or engage in business, they do not will that which they are doing at the time; for who would desire to take the risk of a voyage or the trouble of business?—But they will, to have the wealth for the sake of which they go on a voyage. POLUS: Certainly. SOCRATES: And is not this universally true? If a man does something for the sake of something else, he wills not that which he does, but that for the sake of which he does it. POLUS: Yes. SOCRATES: And are not all things either good or evil, or intermediate and indifferent? 179