Seite - 1382 - in The Complete Plato

Cleinias. Let it be so laid down. Athenian. I suppose that there must be rulers and subjects in states? Cleinias. Certainly. Athenian. And what are the principles on which men rule and obey in cities, whether great or small; and similarly in families? What are they, and how many in number? Is there not one claim of authority which is always just —that of fathers and mothers and in general of progenitors to rule over their offspring? Cleinias. There is. Athenian. Next follows the principle that the noble should rule over the ignoble; and, thirdly, that the elder should rule and the younger obey? Cleinias. To be sure. Athenian. And, fourthly, that slaves should be ruled, and their masters rule? Cleinias. Of course. Athenian. Fifthly, if I am not mistaken, comes the principle that the stronger shall rule, and the weaker be ruled? Cleinias. That is a rule not to be disobeyed. Athenian. Yes, and a rule which prevails very widely among all creatures, and is according to nature, as the Theban poet Pindar once said; and the sixth principle, and the greatest of all, is, that the wise should lead and command, and the ignorant follow and obey; and yet, O thou most wise Pindar, as I should reply him, this surely is not contrary to nature, but according to nature, being the rule of law over willing subjects, and not a rule of compulsion. Cleinias. Most true. Athenian. There is a seventh kind of rule which is awarded by lot, and is dear to the Gods and a token of good fortune: he on whom the lot falls is a ruler, and he who fails in obtaining the lot goes away and is the subject; and this we affirm to be quite just. Cleinias. Certainly. Athenian. “Then now,” as we say playfully to any of those who lightly undertake the making of laws, “you see, legislator, the principles of government, how many they are, and that they are naturally opposed to each other. There we have discovered a fountain–head of seditions, to which you must attend. And, first, we will ask you to consider with us, how and in what respect the kings of Argos and Messene violated these our maxims, and 1382